Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

[evilsoup]

well I've just watched videos of children convulsing and dying in Syria on TV
so I'm not really up for sarcastic ironic look at me I'm a stone cold bastard bullshit right now

[Oxymoron]

Hmm ? What's the news ? I haven't fired on the teevee or followed the news since at least sunday.

[Infinity Biscuit]

Chemical weapon attack killed up to 1300 in eastern Damascus : (

[Oxymoron]

Oh for fuck sake

Just read a bit of news

Seems like the Russians played their hands well.

I don't see how we can avoid a direct intervention in Syria now and don't lose the tiny little bit of credibility the Western World had left.

Shit.

Well, at least it seems I know what's going to be the theater for the years to come.

I'll need to start learning Arabic...

[Oxymoron]

I mean, we could ask Turkey and Israel to do something, but I seriously doubt Israel would want to do anything (as far as they're concerned, the current situation is to their advantage as long as the conflict doesn't bleed in their own territories), and I doubt Turkey would have the logistics to do much without a serious boost from NATO and the UN - which would likely mean boots on the ground from powers external to the region.

[evilsoup]

foreign armies invading wouldn't make anything better
there might be a case for Libya-style airstrikes of chemical weapon stores or something, maybe

[Flagg]

Allah Akbar.

fuck off

No U.

[evilsoup]

that's the sparkling wit I come here for lol

[Oxymoron]

foreign armies invading wouldn't make anything better
there might be a case for Libya-style airstrikes of chemical weapon stores or something, maybe

Probably, yes. The problem is that if it would MAYBE (and that's a big hypothetical there) manage to stop at least the worst atrocities, it remain that right now, Syria has pretty much disintegrated as a country, and both sides pretty much stink the same (the only difference I see is that Assad's forces got access to meaner weapons).

Unless you managed by some miracle to get everyone to sit at a table, discuss and by some miracle manage to solve their problems diplomatically, I don't see any issue out of the bloodshed that doesn't involve a third party getting highly involved, indirectly (supplying to one side arms, supplies, strategic advices and intelligence, etc...) or directly (boots on the ground).

[Flagg]

foreign armies invading wouldn't make anything better
there might be a case for Libya-style airstrikes of chemical weapon stores or something, maybe

Probably, yes. The problem is that if it would MAYBE (and that's a big hypothetical there) manage to stop at least the worst atrocities, it remain that right now, Syria has pretty much disintegrated as a country, and both sides pretty much stink the same (the only difference I see is that Assad's forces got access to meaner weapons).

Unless you managed by some miracle to get everyone to sit at a table, discuss and by some miracle manage to solve their problems diplomatically, I don't see any issue out of the bloodshed that doesn't involve a third party getting highly involved, indirectly (supplying to one side arms, supplies, strategic advices and intelligence, etc...) or directly (boots on the ground).

If the EU wants to do something I won't be unhappy, but I don't want the US involved in a land war.

[Oxymoron]

Just lend-lease us that shit

Oh, we might also need access to some of your Naval- and Air-assets, but that doesn't technically count as "being involved in a land war", so whatever.


But realistically, if something happen, it's going to be a UN mandate that will be handled by NATO, so it'll be hard for the US to maintain its distance.

[Jung]

in other news my grandfather died yesterday morning

Random internet person condolences, for what they're worth.

[RogueIce]

Giant Military Hovercraft Lands on Crowded Beach Because Russia

I wonder what was going through the minds of that crew when they were trying to conduct their exercise and saw a bunch of beachgoers.

Credit to the Russkies for still going on land, though. The USN probably would have just aborted if they saw all those civvies.

[Bakustra]

i've just been busy with real life shit y'know and i think los is the same way

in other news my grandfather died yesterday morning

he left here a few days after my birthday last month and went back to the farm in the old country

month later he's gone

we both knew his time was up, i'm glad he died where he wanted to instead of spending who knows how long hooked up to machines here

shit i'm sorry dude

[thejester]

i've just been busy with real life shit y'know and i think los is the same way

in other news my grandfather died yesterday morning

he left here a few days after my birthday last month and went back to the farm in the old country

month later he's gone

we both knew his time was up, i'm glad he died where he wanted to instead of spending who knows how long hooked up to machines here

holy shit man

my granddad died Tuesday morning as well

thoughts to your family

[adr]

my grandfather died over the weekend too. this is a bad week for grandfathers

mine was diagnosed with lung cancer around march. they said it is pretty bad and he prolly had only about 6 months to live but they tried the treatment and we actually started to get our hopes up in the last month. he had been through a lot of hell, but it actually seemed to be working. a few weeks ago he was up and about again and the x-rays etc showed it getting better

then all of a sudden it pops up in his liver. then is back in the lungs. and the intestines. went downhill very fast and that was it. we had the funeral monday, my second in four years.

....and on the ride up to the cemetery, a few family members had to have their fucking cigarettes. god damn it, i'd like to go at least another four years without another funeral.

[RyanThunder]

Giant Military Hovercraft Lands on Crowded Beach Because Russia

holy shit I didn't know they could build those that big

[Oxymoron]

The downside is that those things suck so much fuel that their effective range is really short - just enough to cross the Baltic Sea and back with some margin of comfort.

[Bounty]

Giant Military Hovercraft Lands on Crowded Beach Because Russia

holy shit I didn't know they could build those that big

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lun-class_ekranoplan

Not a hovercraft, but same function.

[Oxymoron]

Hmmm... There was a thought that crossed my mind a few minutes ago...

Basically, I was thinking back on Richard Dawkins and The Amazing Atheist ( http://manboobz.com/2012/02/08/theamazi ... -meltdown/ ), and, well it's more anecdotal than a real trend with only two samples ; but I'm troubled about how mysoginistic, and somewhat conservative they are while professing liberalism in social matters.

I think this may have a root in the fact that they are basically still Christian Missionaries, but professing "No Religion" rather than the contrary.


I dunno, it's pretty confused right now.

Anyone thought about this before ?

[Jung]

Well the lack of self-awareness it takes to be that kind of atheist and not realize how Christian its attitudes are would certainly help with maintaining reactionary attitudes while being a self-professed liberal.

And given the tradition of associating masculinity with reason and femininity with emotion and valuing the former above the latter it's not really a surprise that a movement that's big on RATIONALITY! WE'RE SO RATIONAL! THOSE IRRATIONAL STUPID PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IRRATIONAL THINGS! would have a lot of subterranean misogyny. The confrontational I TOTALLY PWNED THAT FUNDIE ANOTHER BLOW FOR REASON! culture would fit with that too - aggression and confrontationalism being another thing traditionally gendered male.

[Infinity Biscuit]

A lot of liberalism is full of largely self-interest of privileged people who don't really want to challenge most of the existing kyriarchy or even deal with the discomfort that arises from acknowledging that it exists and they benefit from it.

It is fairly interesting (and by interesting I mean sad) that a lot of people who pride themselves in seeing through the bootstraps myth on a free market vs regulations and welfare level refuse to see that the playing field isn't level on so many other ways, though.

On a specific level, Internet atheism is often incredibly socially conservative in many senses, and has been for a while.

[evilsoup]

so Manning has officially come out as a transwoman now
it was so weird to hear radio four talking about this stuff that I normally come across online

[Jung]

On a specific level, Internet atheism is often incredibly socially conservative in many senses, and has been for a while.

I think that may actually be doing a disservice to social conservatives - my impression is it's more associated with the lolbertarian/MRA/PUA crowd that strikes me as a significantly more toxic brand of sexism. I feel like quoting something I wrote on SB yesterday:

I actually kind of have a bias toward thinking leftist sexists are more toxic than right wing ones.

Traditional sexists at least have a somewhat consistent thought-out system and tend to actually like women, albeit in the same way adults like children. Left-wing sexists on the other hand seem to tend to fit into two categories:

1) Smug head in the sand hypocrites without a scrap of self-awareness who are completely in denial about how sexist they are, often while righteously judging minority groups like Muslims for oppressing women.
2) Completely toxic MRA types who actually believe men are some kind of oppressed minority and see women as class enemies and are filled with righteous anger toward them.

It's the difference between noblesse oblige aristocrats and Randroids. The former at least tries to bandage with one hand the wounds they inflict with the other. The latter is a selfish self-righteous narcissist who thinks he's the real victim.

[Infinity Biscuit]

I'm using "socially conservative" in the sense of "conservative in a real sense, ie opposed to social justice changes" not "conservative on the current US political scale". Like when amazingatheist was featured on stfuconservatives and had a meltdown because he's not CONSERVATIVE he HATES republicans

MRAs are by nature socially conservative by opposing the changes feminism wishes to bring or has already brought, for example.