Godammed SDN

[artemas]

i am assured of this

[adr-admin]

oh fuck it i can't get it to work right through all the layers of shit in here

i need to get back to real work

and turn off my heater

[starku]

You know I be loving with this

[Nietzslime]

what's going on here guys

[starku]

you missed it bro

it was a crazy ride

[Nietzslime]

insufficient documentation

[starku]

sorry droog i was workin

i am not trying to be mean to the utmost

[Losonti Tokash]

Or they would be under no pressure to work at all, therefore making sure that a class of proles exists solely by leeching off others.

[Aaron]

Isn't that what the rich do right now?

[Veef]

Isn't that what the rich do right now?

class warfare

[Mr Flibble]

I am not sure what "workers' rights" are, and therefore am not sure that I believe they should exist.

Umm What? Someone needs to get Surly to an economics course that isn't full of neoclassical crap, he's losing it.

[Aaron]

Another old boy joins the nutter brigade. Excellent.

[Losonti Tokash]

Let me know if I miss anything, but here's what I believe workers' rights to be:

1) a living wage
2) a safe work environment
3) freedom from discrimination based on race, sex, religion, sexual orientation, political beliefs, etc
4) the freedom to organize and collectively bargain to protect themselves and their fellow workers from the predations of corporations

but shit can't let those damned poors monopolize labor

[Veef]

why all these stupid altruistic urges?

Also what fucking retard would honestly fellate Shep's ego and say they'd vote him for president?

[adr-admin]

unions are just capitalism at work

[Dooey Jo]

no guise we have laws and governments now

those things never go away and are not constantly lobbied at by employers' organisations to erode workers' rights

so if we outlaw unions

what could possibly go wrong


and starglider of course has to chime in with a bit of truth

unions would be okay if it were required for them to wear big bird suits

oh sorry, that's racist

i meant to say fuck you, between-union competition can only weaken them in the struggle against employers

but of course you know that because that's the whole point

fuck a stork

[Sandman]

Remember guys, they're the Smartest Board on the Internet.

Though we're in the middle of a gigantic world economic crisis caused by the bollockry of corporations screwing around with the world at large. Even SDN-dwelling morons ought to be able to figure out why putting worker's rights in the hands of lobbyist-controlled governments without any representation from the unions is a bad thing, given the current situation.

[Aaron]

Let me know if I miss anything, but here's what I believe workers' rights to be:

1) a living wage
2) a safe work environment
3) freedom from discrimination based on race, sex, religion, sexual orientation, political beliefs, etc
4) the freedom to organize and collectively bargain to protect themselves and their fellow workers from the predations of corporations

but shit can't let those damned poors monopolize labor

No firing without cause?

[Sandman]

I think adequate provisions in case of long-term sickness and other such ought to be on there.

[Losonti Tokash]

Good idea, Aaron.

Sandman, could you define what you mean?

[Sandman]

Good idea, Aaron.

Sandman, could you define what you mean?

In case of severe and long-term forms of illness and or injury, you shouldn't necessarily lose your job due to the month or so you might wind up having to take off, as long as you can theoretically go back to it at the end. Parental leave ought to qualify as a subset of something like this. As an addition to that, there should be provisions for disabled and disadvantaged workers, such as ergonomic keyboards, easy wheelchair access, etc. - though I suppose that might be covered under safe working environment.

[Losonti Tokash]

I would also consider that to part of the freedom from discrimination, but yeah.

So we've got the first 4, plus

5) No firing without cause
6) Parental or medical leave, with the guarantee of their old position or one of similar pay/rank upon their return

[Veef]

gawd why just give them free money for nothing like during christmas or something

such altruism will ruin this country

[Bounty]

I would also consider that to part of the freedom from discrimination, but yeah.

So we've got the first 4, plus

5) No firing without cause
6) Parental or medical leave, with the guarantee of their old position or one of similar pay/rank upon their return

I think you can fold 5 and 6 into a general 'job security' clause (like, "The right to continue working until justified dismissal, after timely notification and with due compensation").

incidentally welcome to europe ca 1850-1950, we may have some experience with this problem

[Losonti Tokash]

The issue with that phrasing is that I can see someone go "well of course she still had the right to continue working after she got pregnant, she just not to so she could take care of her kid."