Godammed SDN

[uraniun235]

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... 2&t=153797

lol baffalo strikes again

[Zablorg]

But D13 is also quite stubbornly arguing that you need something called "free will" in order to have morality.

Is that guy claiming it's possible to have morality when all of your thoughts and actions have been predetermined?

look i'm pretty sure determinism is totally real

(even if our actions are not predetermined then they are determined by raw chance and that's not much better when you think about it)

but it's only worth considering in a really meta sense

throwing your hands up and saying "I AM NOT A FREE AGENT" isn't productive towards anything anyone actually cares about

[Dooey Jo]

"free will" can be taken to mean that you have a choice you can reason about, even though what you ultimately choose may be predetermined or predictable. it can also be taken to mean other things, but even then it's not like you can just declare discussions about physicalism and causality to be settled.

but in light of such uncertainties, perhaps it would be more fruitful to discuss why free will is important to the discussion. of course, if there is no choice, then discussing what the "right" choice is, is pointless. you can't say 1+1 "should" be 5, after all. but maybe you can come up with a definition of choice which is consistent with whatever view of reality you ascribe to, even if "free will" may not be

Stock market crashes
No sign of debris
Assume vaporization

200 gigaton stock market crash.

Enough to kill Star Trek ten times over

[Aaron]

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... 2&t=153797

lol baffalo strikes again

That made me cringe.

[adr-admin]

free will is one of those things i see as super abstract

whether there's some physical gizmo that BOOM FREE WILL CAN BE FOUND HERE ON THE MRI

i don't really care

the concept w0rx

[Civil War Man]

I usually stay away from SLAM, but while checking out the clusterfuck in the secular morality thread, I saw one about the double standard between what constitutes militant atheism and militant theism. And I realized that a lot of first world Dawkins-like atheists have a pretty massive persecution complex going on.

I mean, since atheism isn't any form of belief system or anything like that, it's pretty hard to actually be persecuted on a systemic level outside of banning anything that isn't explicitly religiously affiliated. No one is trying to block the construction of a secular community center by claiming it's trying to impose some vague atheist law on the country. No one is trying to pass a constitutional amendment denying atheists the right to marry.

But oh no a poll says a lot of people don't trust atheists.

Just as a disclaimer, I'm not denying that there's persecution of some atheists on a personal level in this country, but it is not nearly as systemic, and almost never as bad, as the shit muslims and gays have to put up with.

[Zod]

I usually stay away from SLAM, but while checking out the clusterfuck in the secular morality thread, I saw one about the double standard between what constitutes militant atheism and militant theism. And I realized that a lot of first world Dawkins-like atheists have a pretty massive persecution complex going on.

I mean, since atheism isn't any form of belief system or anything like that, it's pretty hard to actually be persecuted on a systemic level outside of banning anything that isn't explicitly religiously affiliated. No one is trying to block the construction of a secular community center by claiming it's trying to impose some vague atheist law on the country. No one is trying to pass a constitutional amendment denying atheists the right to marry.

But oh no a poll says a lot of people don't trust atheists.

Just as a disclaimer, I'm not denying that there's persecution of some atheists on a personal level in this country, but it is not nearly as systemic, and almost never as bad, as the shit muslims and gays have to put up with.

Try talking about atheism on any kind of news site's discussion section. The amount of vitriol and ignorance towards atheists is hilariously sad.

[Oxymoron]

I've heard things about a supposed "American Victimization Culture" (the "Help, I'm being oppressed" syndrome), a thing in the American culture that supposedly push everyone to try to, by default, portrait themselves as victims, for whatever reasons (maybe the idea that if you are a victim then you can't be the one committing something wrong ?).


Can it come from something like this ?

[Zod]

I've heard things about a supposed "American Victimization Complex", a thing in the American culture that supposedly push everyone to try to, by default, portrait themselves as victims, for whatever reasons (maybe the idea that if you are a victim then you can't be the one committing something wrong ?).

Can it come from something like this ?

I think Christianity can take the blame here.

Matthew 5:10-12 (NKJV) Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

[Oxymoron]

I see. And I suppose the Civil Rights issues, and then the whole crop of activist movements that that came after (abortion, gay rights, etc...) took up on it.

[Zod]

I see. And I suppose the Civil Rights issues, and then the whole crop of activist movements that that came after (abortion, gay rights, etc...) took up on it.

Take a look at the latest birth control healthcare fiasco with the Catholic shitheads.

They're claiming it's their "Rosa Parks" moment and that their beliefs are being attacked.

[adr-admin]

one time i saw some people praying in front of me

so i shot and killed them for infringing upon my freedom from religion

[adr-admin]

get your strawmanning ass out of this thread adr

this is your final warning

[Oxymoron]

get your strawmanning ass out of this thread adr

this is your final warning

"Strawman"
"Red Herring"
"Burden Of Proof"
...

Is there a TVTropes for debating ? Cuz' I've always got the impression that if one exist, these people come from it.

[adr-admin]

omg omg omg omg omg omg

that's a brilliant idea

[Civil War Man]

I see. And I suppose the Civil Rights issues, and then the whole crop of activist movements that that came after (abortion, gay rights, etc...) took up on it.

Take a look at the latest birth control healthcare fiasco with the Catholic shitheads.

They're claiming it's their "Rosa Parks" moment and that their beliefs are being attacked.

On the birth control issue, it's pretty hilarious how Fox news had an all-male panel to discuss birth control, and that congress had a hearing on birth control where all of the people testifying were men.

Anyway, the thing that really drove home the persecution complex thing was how they have this thread about how atheists are portrayed as militant for admitting they even exist and how it's so unfair right next to a thread where deedub banned a guy for questioning his views on morality. Made even more hilarious because the "you are banned" post descended straight into paranoid conspiracy theory delusion by accusing Legault of being a secret Christian fundamentalist who was pretending to be an atheist in order to destroy the atheists on an internet message board.

[Dooey Jo]

teh christians are sending sleeper agents to question our logics!!

[Oxymoron]

Made even more hilarious because the "you are banned" post descended straight into paranoid conspiracy theory delusion by accusing Legault of being a secret Christian fundamentalist who was pretending to be an atheist in order to destroy the atheists on an internet message board.

If you think that your "beliefs" can be so easily challenged, maybe you should seriously consider putting them into question yourself, don't'cha think ?

[Dooey Jo]

the most intellectually honest thing is to ban all dissent

[Oxymoron]

I propose a Versus debate :

SDN Vs. HPCA

What happen ?

[starku]

one time i saw some people praying in front of me

so i shot and killed them for infringing upon my freedom from religion

Near where I got married in my secular atheist civil union there were some Muslim women wearing headscarves

Of course I called the police

[uraniun235]

This also begs the question of whether our modern humanitarian society, by being so reluctant to use execution or forced sterilization upon even the most heinous of criminals, is inadvertently encouraging the cancer-like growth of sociopathic behaviour in our population. If sociopathic behaviour is a genetic trait (and there is increasingly disturbing evidence that it is), then it would make sense to try to eliminate its growth in our gene pool.

[Bakustra]

man, i love that darkwing duck is an eugenicist too

he really is a winner, isn't he?

[Bakustra]

I propose a Versus debate :

SDN Vs. HPCA

What happen ?

on the last incarnation of this board i described tropers vs. slade fanboys as a cage match between ground sloths

im not sure what this is in comparison- possibly a boxing match between weasels

[starku]

This also begs the question of whether our modern humanitarian society, by being so reluctant to use execution or forced sterilization upon even the most heinous of criminals, is inadvertently encouraging the cancer-like growth of sociopathic behaviour in our population. If sociopathic behaviour is a genetic trait (and there is increasingly disturbing evidence that it is), then it would make sense to try to eliminate its growth in our gene pool.

are you serisous