New Testingstan

Stofsk wrote:Shatner didn't write the books IIRC, they were ghost written by Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stevens.

Yeah, it was more that Shatner 'wrote' them. He's supposed to have come up with the general plot though.

That much is obvious. Kirk pulls some hot hot klingon/romulan hybrid tail? No self indulgence there!

Well, Kirk is supposed to be an over the top character.

Eh, not really. I think that's something the fans have projected onto the character. The exploits in the show and the movies paint a different picture, like for all everyone keeps going on about 'kirk-fu' and 'ripped shirt kirk pwns everyone', he gets his ass handed to him nearly as often as he kicks ass. He's also as committed to peace as Picard was, although he was more of a soldier than Picard. But people tend to ignore the times when Kirk said 'We're peaceful explorers' and tend to overemphasise 'ZOMG GENERAL ORDER 24 KIRK A BADASS'. What about the time when Kirk spared the Gorn his life? Or rendered aid to Balok after spending the last few hours being terrorised by him?

Similarly everyone going on about his womanising habits. What people tend to ignore is that he never has any long term relationship with anyone that was successful and didn't end in heartache, and thinks back to many an old flame with a lot of regret. When he was on the Shore Leave planet the alien technology there conjured up an old flame from his past and the sense of regret on Kirk's face was palpable. The unnamed blonde tech Gary Mitchell threw his way was another sore point: Mitchell admits to having outlined her whole campaign for her, to which Kirk exclaims how he nearly married her - all so Mitchell could distract him during a class he was taking that Kirk taught. The theory (which I don't know if it was accepted by the PTB or not) that this unnamed woman was in fact Carol Marcus, makes this doubly tragic - as she raised his son by completely excluding Kirk from his life.

There is a lot of nuance to the character that gets ignored. But all anyone gives a shit about is all the alien chicks he seduces occasionally (and it's not as frequent as people claim). And those are the same guys who are writing the reboot Trek.

You've just activated Stofsk's Trap Card.

Stofsk wrote:Eh, not really. I think that's something the fans have projected onto the character. The exploits in the show and the movies paint a different picture, like for all everyone keeps going on about 'kirk-fu' and 'ripped shirt kirk pwns everyone', he gets his ass handed to him nearly as often as he kicks ass. He's also as committed to peace as Picard was, although he was more of a soldier than Picard. But people tend to ignore the times when Kirk said 'We're peaceful explorers' and tend to overemphasise 'ZOMG GENERAL ORDER 24 KIRK A BADASS'. What about the time when Kirk spared the Gorn his life? Or rendered aid to Balok after spending the last few hours being terrorised by him?

Similarly everyone going on about his womanising habits. What people tend to ignore is that he never has any long term relationship with anyone that was successful and didn't end in heartache, and thinks back to many an old flame with a lot of regret. When he was on the Shore Leave planet the alien technology there conjured up an old flame from his past and the sense of regret on Kirk's face was palpable. The unnamed blonde tech Gary Mitchell threw his way was another sore point: Mitchell admits to having outlined her whole campaign for her, to which Kirk exclaims how he nearly married her - all so Mitchell could distract him during a class he was taking that Kirk taught. The theory (which I don't know if it was accepted by the PTB or not) that this unnamed woman was in fact Carol Marcus, makes this doubly tragic - as she raised his son by completely excluding Kirk from his life.

There is a lot of nuance to the character that gets ignored. But all anyone gives a shit about is all the alien chicks he seduces occasionally (and it's not as frequent as people claim). And those are the same guys who are writing the reboot Trek.

So is nuKirk a one dimensional action man? I haven't seen it yet.

You know, not really all that much on the action man part, since he's actually not all that good in a fight. He's more of a punkish kid who's learning to become a leader while also being something of a ladies' man to at least a partial extent...

timmy wrote:You've just activated Stofsk's Trap Card.

Well like I said, the trilogy did end with him convincing Evil Kirk to reform and return to his universe to work for democracy.

Granted I I think he killed Evil Picard in a manner the details of which I cannot quite recall but which I am sure were humiliating, but still.

Ralin wrote:Well like I said, the trilogy did end with him convincing Evil Kirk to reform and return to his universe to work for democracy.

What now?



FELLAHS, THIS THING'S TOP SECRET

Someone at SA whipped up this morph animation comparing the two main Ent-D shooting models:



here's another, non-animated comparison:

http://i.imgur.com/nARDAqS.jpg

Scary

That's painful to watch.

I don't know which I like more: the 4-foot model aztec pattern gives it more depth, while the 6-foot model looks bigger (which, herp derp shouldn't be surprising).

(Data pulls La Forge away from a computer access panel that is shocking him)
"Data?"
"Yes?"
"What happened?"
"Any answer would be mere speculation. This is yet another example of how our actions have random results."
"Thanks, Data... I noticed."

I love that scene. I love Data's "oh shit" face there.

Just watched Flashback again. Sat through it thinking 'wow, got Takei back into the chair after all those years', then realised it was only five years. Only five.

Yeah I always find it amazing that the TOS movies were going on at the same time as TNG

so i was just laying in bed thinking about the patriarchy in science fiction and i had to get back on the computer for a moment to throw this down

i think the romulan empire has more women in command of starships than the federation starfleet. now tng had a number of woman admirals but when it comes to captain i can only think of two off the top of my head, captain rice i think was her name, from "conspiracy", and captain garrett of the enterprise c

then star trek 4 had a woman captain iirc of the saratoga, that ship that lost power to the probe

and obviously captain janeway


there's number one and uhura and doctor crusher and dax and kira that all temporarily take command but it is never their ships so they don't count


i'm prolly forgetting some but the number surely ain't very big.....


now let's compare to the romulans:

1) the commander in "the enterprise incident".
2) ummmm god my brain ain't working right now, denise crosby's romulan tng character. oh sela that's it
3) again i can't recall her name, but the commander of the warbird in "face of the enemy" (and honorable mention to troi in that ep too)
4) dina meyer in star trek nemesis

i'm pretty sure there's at least one ds9 example too but i can't remember an episode


regardless off the top of my head i could only name four starfleet woman captains

and four romulan woman captains



oh wait a minute what about captain..... gah names, the captain of the lakota in ds9, she was a woman. say wasn't she the same actress as doctor leah brahms?

well anyway, ok maybe starfleet wins on raw numbers, but consider how many more starfleet captains we see than romulan captains

and i gotta say the romulan empire seems to be doing pretty ok in this category

geordi's mum was also in command of a ship.

I'd count Dax as well. Since she was officially in command of the Defiant for the Domion War arc. When Sisko was promoted to Admiral's adjunct or whatever.

The Romulan Commander in Enterprise Incident is remarkable though considering it was probably the first example of a female starship captain. Though I guess it was slightly undermined by her being seduced by spock into giving up her cloaking device (not a euthamism)

But considering what 'turnabout intruder' had to say about women in starfleet the Romulans definitely come out on top in that era.

edit: i was going to say Sela was an admiral and therefore didn't count by your definition but that was only in Star Trek: Armada which is basically what I remember her best from: allying with the borg and then backstabbing them. Badass.

So it turns out Drexfiles is gone. Such a shame, I enjoyed all that insight.

Crazedwraith wrote:I'd count Dax as well. Since she was officially in command of the Defiant for the Domion War arc. When Sisko was promoted to Admiral's adjunct or whatever.

Really? I thought that was Worf's job. Being Number One on the Defiant whenever the writers didn't forget and made him subordinate to Kira even though she was only supposed to be XO of the station, not being in Starfleet and all (except that one episode when she was).

Plus Worf switched over to Red for that purpose, and he outranked Dax. Unless he was off with the Klingons or whatever, it's been awhile.

i'm pretty sure for those five episodes or so when the station was occupied dax was indeed captaining the defiant, I remember her giving the phaser depleted speech in the mess hall once. worf was being martok's first officer on a Klingon ship at the time iirc

so yeah i'll count her.

re sela she might have been an admiral by unification or the games, but I think in redemption she served the same role as picard: captaining her own ship as well as commanding the group, and I believe her rank was commander (same as other romulan ship captains).

but I won't count turnabout intruder cuz that line is un star treky and that episode is weak.

RogueIce wrote:

Crazedwraith wrote:I'd count Dax as well. Since she was officially in command of the Defiant for the Domion War arc. When Sisko was promoted to Admiral's adjunct or whatever.

Really? I thought that was Worf's job. Being Number One on the Defiant whenever the writers didn't forget and made him subordinate to Kira even though she was only supposed to be XO of the station, not being in Starfleet and all (except that one episode when she was).

Plus Worf switched over to Red for that purpose, and he outranked Dax. Unless he was off with the Klingons or whatever, it's been awhile.

Worf didn't outrank her, they held the same rank. And more to the point, he was acting as Martok's starfleet liason and XO.

Also, 'Turnabout Intruder' is a pile of horseshit and should be stricken from the record IMO. It's up there with 'Code of Honor'

timmy wrote:So it turns out Drexfiles is gone. Such a shame, I enjoyed all that insight.

Apparently some people complained because Drexler was putting pictures (properly credited AFAIK) on his blog and they chucked a hissy fit over it.