Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

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RogueIce
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#826 Post by RogueIce »

Darksi4190 wrote:http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/ ... an.268446/

The kicker is that I do think she comes off a little judgmental towards gamers at certain points in her videos, and at times does seem like a "stop having fun girl," but this is goddamn ridiculous. I mean they just won't let it go. Any time Sarkeesian puts out a new video or someone tries to refute her arguments Spacebattles explodes into a 20 page thread.
What bugs me is that every time, like clockwork, people will fucking complain about the Kickstarter money and "THAT'S NOT A $100,000 VIDEO!!!!! :argh: " or some shit.

And I'm like dude just shut the fuck up already about the goddamn money. Seriously. Why the fuck does it matter? How she spends the money that was raised is between her, the people who paid it and whatever the Kickstarter Terms of Service have to say about it. That's it.

But no, people keep beating that dead horse and won't let shit go. The sad thing is, there may be legitimate criticisms of her videos, but they either never get made or are drowned out by OMG TEH MONIES asshats. And I just want to go in there, grab them by the shoulders, and shout: "Dude enough about the Kickstarter, nobody fucking cares. If you got a problem with the way she portrays characters and situations or whatever, talk about that. Quit whining about the money."

Or I would if I gave half a shit about the Great Anita Sakeesian Internet Debate. I have seen one or two semi-thoughtful responses out there about how she does mischaracterize or whatever, and to be fair the complaint about taking from LP videos would be legitimate in that context of showing she hasn't played and/or understood the examples she's using. Which I think would be a legitimate issue to point out. But when I look at her games covered list I realize I probably haven't played like 90% of them so I honestly have no idea who has the correct interpretation.

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Stofsk
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#827 Post by Stofsk »

joviwan wrote:DotA is a great game at low levels of play and at high levels of play.

The middle levels of play are the shit ones, and I avoid them by only playing co-op bots with friends.
It just spins me out that every game takes place on the same exact map, which has the same exact creeps and the same exact pathway for the enemy dudes to travel down, with the same exact towers defending the same exact spots in the same exact map in every game which plays out exactly the same everytime. But I repeat myself.

The only variation that exists is which characters the other side's team is made up of, and pretty soon you learn which ones are the dangerous ones you kite the fuck away from and only ever engage with your team backing you up, and which ones you can comfortably take by yourself. I admit, there are aspects to this particular part of the game that actually is a lot of fun. But a lot of it is still just 'kite kite kite turn attack kite kite attack kite' etc. The overall gameplay experience is marred by the exact sameness I described in the previous paragraph, and how anal some people are in your team. 'No no you're playing that guy wrong, he's supposed to do X not Y.' 'No no don't kill the creeps, because I need the XP more than you.' 'Hold off on killing those guys by constantly clickin stop to prevent your toon from auto-attacking.' This last one just made me go wtflol, are you fucking serious?

Then there are the times when you fuck up early into the game and the rest of the game just snowballs to the point where you can't recover. It's a bit like Starcraft actually. That's another game that follows your observation, bronze league stuff is fun but stupid, where people do Stuff You're Not Supposed To Do but nobody gives a fuck. Pro league stuff is amazing and superfucking cool but totally out of the experience of 99% of people who play the game. And for everything in-between, you just want to set fire to something or punch your computer monitor.

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Oxymoron
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#828 Post by Oxymoron »

Yeah, the problematic part in multiplayer games, is the players. And more exactly, it's how people seems to forget that games are actually meant to be fun, and start loosing their shit when things don't go how they would have hoped, insulting other people, calling them "noobs" (the Supreme Insult, it seems...), calling other people idiots or I'M A JUGGALO WOOP WOOP, etc...

That's why I have a rule : in game, if a player is insulting, I automatically ignore what he / she's saying. It doesn't matter what is being said. I just ignore it. Or sometimes I just tell them to shut up.
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Darksi4190
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#829 Post by Darksi4190 »

Infinity Biscuit wrote:Have you considered that you may be bothered significantly less by things like slurs, bigoted language, and threats of violence (sexual or no) when you're a straight guy?
That's a distinct possibility.

zhaktronz
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#830 Post by zhaktronz »

That's called privledge

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Agent Bert Macklin
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#831 Post by Agent Bert Macklin »

zhaktronz wrote:That's called privledge
That white, straight, western male privilege.

Georgia: http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/story/23335 ... ol-offices

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evilsoup
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#832 Post by evilsoup »

I can't see how that could possibly go wrong lol
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Questor
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#833 Post by Questor »

A) See IB's post
B) The "Gamer" culture is toxic in so many ways that your comment just makes me think you haven't thought it through.
C) I stopped being part of the "gamer" group, if I ever was a part of it, long ago, but it seems to me there was a massive culture shift back around about 2002-2003 with the rise of the MMO. All of a sudden, someone being a jerk wasn't just something that went away when you switched servers. With persistence and online worlds, one jerk could destroy hundreds of hours (or more) of work. Some people reveled in that, and others (like me) left.

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#834 Post by RogueIce »

evilsoup wrote:I can't see how that could possibly go wrong lol
They're for cops who are already there anyway, not teachers or admins. Presumably it'd be kept locked up in a safe or something.

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Questor
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#835 Post by Questor »

Yeah, put them in the cop cars. School's have enough of a problem with vandalism and break ins that this is idiotic.

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#836 Post by Gands »

I'm still baffled at the idea of schools that have police officers.

Are those police normally armed?

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#837 Post by Questor »

Yeah, but the functions depend on the school. Full time cops are usually only seen at the high school level.

They're gonna be working full time on actual police things, investigating, protecting, serving, taking witness statements, acting as a walking radio connection to 911 dispatch. You'd be amazed how much theft goes on even at a relatively affluent school, low level assaults (fights) aren't particularly uncommon, drugs problems, Drug education, Truancy enforcement, alcohol issues. They coordinate traffic enforcement in the parking lot.

In the US, an unarmed cop is an exception. We can debate the merits of that, but thats how it is.

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#838 Post by timmy »

Questor wrote:A) See IB's post
B) The "Gamer" culture is toxic in so many ways that your comment just makes me think you haven't thought it through.
C) I stopped being part of the "gamer" group, if I ever was a part of it, long ago, but it seems to me there was a massive culture shift back around about 2002-2003 with the rise of the MMO. All of a sudden, someone being a jerk wasn't just something that went away when you switched servers. With persistence and online worlds, one jerk could destroy hundreds of hours (or more) of work. Some people reveled in that, and others (like me) left.
I've mentioned this before; facebook's 'Cosplay' page is a regular fixture in my feed. I'm a fan of cosplay because I like to dress up myself, and I certainly appreciate effort that people put into portraying a favourite character. But myself and those likeminded have to endure waves of 14 year olds repeating sexist memes ad naseum because all they're seeing is a body, not the mind that set about (re)creating a costume. It's the kind of thing that makes you want to emp the servers for Live and PSN.
"also it really shits my mum so it's a good way of winding her up"

-thejester

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#839 Post by zhaktronz »

Tim buddy I often see you fighting the good fight on that cosplay feed.

Mad respect

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#840 Post by timmy »

I hate 'em Zak. I fuckin' hate 'em and the herd mentality that bred them.
"also it really shits my mum so it's a good way of winding her up"

-thejester

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#841 Post by Big Orangutan »

Gands wrote:I'm still baffled at the idea of schools that have police officers.

Are those police normally armed?
Why are you baffled? Apart from the sensationalist spree school/college shootings that hit the media every 18 months or so, a lot of inner city schools are pretty damn rough with the gangsta culture thing and so the school lobbies have manned metal detectors.
*Insert Pretentious Quote Here*

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#842 Post by zhaktronz »

Because gando lives in a real country instead of a war zone /exaggeration

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adr
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#843 Post by adr »

A lot of people dislike the cops in schools because it often minor disciplinary issues into law enforcement problems - late to school, get a criminal record, talk back to a teacher (especially while black), go to jail, etc.

From what I've seen locally and from news reports, the overall bad outweighs the good, but certain groups like to push for more every time there's one of those rare shootings.
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#844 Post by Civil War Man »

Questor wrote:B) The "Gamer" culture is toxic in so many ways that your comment just makes me think you haven't thought it through.
A lot of this is that gamer culture is a subset of nerd culture, which is extremely fucked up. It is sometimes more accepting due to the whole "social outcast" aspect, but on the other hand it is still a primarily white straight 18-35 male culture with all of the problems that go along with it. The toxicity of the atmosphere changes suddenly and dramatically based entirely on who is in the room at that moment.

The problem's always existed (see the heteronormative power fantasies in stuff like Conan or D&D for example), but at the risk of sounding like a hipster, it feels like the problem's gotten worse since mainstream culture has co-opted being a nerd. Since being a part of nerd culture is no longer considered to be something shameful, the more accepting social outcast demographic has been weakened while the more toxic aspects have been left untouched or even strengthened.

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#845 Post by Bakustra »

i think a large part of that is backlash from the mainstreaming as well- see the recent intensification of "fake nerds" etc. but nerd "culture" was always relatively mainstream and it's just now that there is a Frankensteinian overall culture that these things can be articulated

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#846 Post by Civil War Man »

Bakustra wrote:i think a large part of that is backlash from the mainstreaming as well- see the recent intensification of "fake nerds" etc. but nerd "culture" was always relatively mainstream and it's just now that there is a Frankensteinian overall culture that these things can be articulated
Yeah, I can see how it is a backlash to nerd culture going mainstream. Since much of the nerd identity is based on ostracism, there would be a hostility towards newcomers who don't meet that criteria. If you fulfill the requirements of some social outcast quota, you are "one of us," but if you don't, you are one of the popular kids trying to steal their toys.

Nerd culture being mainstream is a relatively recent phenomenon, though. It's always had an unhealthy obsession with popularity, but most nerd staples didn't really become mainstream until the advent of the internet or later. They were mainstream in the sense that everyone realized they existed, but it's only been within the last couple decades or so that you could openly indulge in some of those pastimes without being viewed as a freak. A grown man reading a superhero comic was an embarrassment. Even interest in massive pop culture phenomena like Star Wars and Star Trek was viewed as unhealthy. The idea that the most popular movies of the past few years have been predominantly adaptations of Tolkien novels and superhero comics would have been unthinkable a mere 20-30 years ago. There were Tolkien adaptations and superhero movies made during that time, and even earlier, but Hollywood has only started viewing them as safe profit generators very recently.

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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#847 Post by Oxymoron »

So, regarding, Syria, here's an interesting thought :
Syria and Byzantine Strategy
by Robert D. Kaplan

In March 1984, I was reporting from the Hawizeh Marshes in southern Iraq near the Iranian border. The Iran-Iraq War was in its fourth year, and the Iranians had just launched a massive infantry attack, which the Iraqis repelled with poison gas. I beheld hundreds of young, dead Iranian soldiers, piled up and floating in the marshes, like dolls without a scar on any of them. An Iraqi officer poked one of the bodies with his walking stick and told me, "This is what happens to the enemies of Saddam [Hussein]." Of course, the Iranians were hostile troops invading Iraqi territory; not civilians. But Saddam got around to killing women and children, too, with chemical weapons. In March 1988, he gassed roughly 5,000 Kurds to death. As a British reporter with me in the Hawizeh Marshes had quipped, "You could fit the human rights of Iraq on the head of a pin, and still have room for the human rights of Iran."

The reaction of the Reagan administration to the gassing to death of thousands of Kurdish civilians by Saddam was to keep supporting him through the end of his war with Iran. The United States was then in the midst of a Cold War with the Soviet Union, and as late as mid-1989 it wouldn't be apparent that this twilight struggle would end so suddenly and so victoriously. Thus, with hundreds of thousands of American servicemen occupied in Europe and northeast Asia, using Saddam's Iraq as a proxy against Ayatollah Khomeini's Iran made perfect sense.

The United States has values, but as a great power it also has interests. Ronald Reagan may have spoken the rousing language of universal freedom, but his grand strategy was all of a piece. And that meant picking and choosing his burdens wisely. As a result, Saddam's genocide against the Kurds, featuring chemical weapons, was overlooked.

In fact, the 1980-1988 Iran-Iraq War, coterminous with the life of the Reagan administration, was a boon to it. By tying down two large and radical states in the heart of the Middle East, the war severely reduced the trouble that each on its own would certainly have caused the region for almost a decade. This gave Reagan an added measure of leeway in order to keep his focus on Europe and the Soviets -- and on hurting the Soviets in Afghanistan. To wit, only two years after the Iran-Iraq War ended, Saddam invaded Kuwait. Peace between Iran and Iraq was arguably no blessing to the United States and the West.

Likewise, it might be argued that the Syrian civil war, now well into its second year, has carried strategic benefits to the West. The analyst Edward N. Luttwak, writing recently in The New York Times, has pointed out that continued fighting in Syria is preferable to either of the two sides winning outright. If President Bashar al Assad's forces were to win, then the Iranians and the Russians would enjoy a much stronger position in the Levant than before the war. If the rebels were to win, it is entirely possible that Sunni jihadists, with ties to transnational terrorism, will have a staging post by the Mediterranean similar to what they had in Taliban-controlled Afghanistan until 2001, and also similar to what they currently have in Libya. So rather than entertain either of those two possibilities, it is better that the war continue.

Of course, all of this is quite cold-blooded. The Iran-Iraq War took the lives of over a million people. The Syrian civil war has so far claimed reportedly 110,000 lives. Even the celebrated realist of the mid-20th century, Hans Morgenthau of the University of Chicago, proclaimed the existence of a universal moral conscience, which sees war as a "natural catastrophe." And it is this very conscience that ultimately limits war's occurrence. That is what makes foreign policy so hard. If it were simply a matter of pursuing a state's naked interests, then there would be few contradictions between desires and actions. If it were simply a matter of defending human rights, there would similarly be fewer hard choices. But foreign policy is both. And because voters will only sustain losses to a nation's treasure when serious interests are threatened, interests often take precedence over values. Thus, awful compromises are countenanced.

Making this worse is the element of uncertainty. The more numerous the classified briefings a leader receives about a complex and dangerous foreign place, the more he may realize how little the intelligence community actually knows. This is not a criticism of the intelligence community, but an acknowledgment of complexity, especially when it concerns a profusion of armed and secretive groups, and an array of hard-to-quantify cultural factors. What option do I pursue? And even if I make the correct choice, how sure can I be of the consequences? And even if I can be sure of the consequences -- which is doubtful -- is it worth diverting me from other necessary matters, both foreign and domestic, for perhaps weeks or even months?

Luttwak himself offers partial relief to such enigmas through a meticulous and erudite study of one of the greatest survival strategies in history. In The Grand Strategy of the Byzantine Empire (2009), he demonstrates the properties by which Byzantium, despite a threatened geographic position, survived for a thousand years after the fall of Rome. This Byzantine strategy, in its own prodigiously varied and often unconscious way, mirrored Morgenthau's realism, laced as it is with humanism.

The Byzantines, Luttwak writes, relied continuously on every method of deterrence. "They routinely paid off their enemies….using all possible tools of persuasion to recruit allies, fragment hostile alliances, subvert unfriendly rulers…" He goes on: "For the Romans…as for most great powers until modern days, military force was the primary tool of statecraft, with persuasion a secondary complement. For the Byzantine Empire it was mostly the other way around. Indeed, the shift of emphasis from force to diplomacy is one way of differentiating Rome from Byzantium…" In other words, "Avoid war by every possible means in all possible circumstances, but always act as if it might start at any time [his italics]." The Byzantines bribed, connived, dissembled and so forth, and as a consequence survived for centuries on end and fought less wars than they would have otherwise.

The lesson: be devious rather than bloody. President Barack Obama's mistake is not his hesitancy about entering the Syrian mess; but announcing to the Syrians that his military strike, if it occurs, will be "narrow" and "limited." Never tell your adversary what you're not going to do! Let your adversary stay awake all night, worrying about the extent of a military strike! Unless Obama is being deliberately deceptive about his war aims, then some of the public statements from the administration have been naïve in the extreme.

A Byzantine strategy, refitted to the postmodern age, would maintain the requisite military force in the eastern Mediterranean, combined with only vague presidential statements about the degree to which such force might or might not be used. It would feature robust, secret and ongoing diplomacy with the Russians and the Iranians, aware always of their interests both regionally and globally, and always open to deals and horse-trades with them. The goal would be to engineer a stalemate-of-sorts in Syria rather than necessarily remove al Assad. Reducing the intensity of fighting would thus constitute a morality in and of itself, even as it would keep either side from winning outright. For if the regime suddenly crumbled, violence might only escalate, and al Qaeda might even find a sanctuary close to Israel and Jordan.

Such a strategy might satisfy relatively few of the cognoscenti. Though, the American public -- which has a more profound, albeit badly articulated sense of national survival -- will surely tolerate it. The Congressional debate that preceded the Iraq War did not save President George W. Bush from obloquy when that war went badly. The lack of such a debate would not hurt Obama were he to successfully execute the methods described in Luttwak's book.


Read more: Syria and Byzantine Strategy | Stratfor
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adr
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#848 Post by adr »

i was checking the newspaper websites to see if Obama has assassinated the archduke yet and was greeted by another story about horsemeat

so I don't get it. why is horsemeat so much worse than cow meat? is it just about being lied to?
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#849 Post by evilsoup »

it's a fairly important principle that you should know what is in your food
horse meat is relatively innocuous, but if they're sneaking that in, what else?
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Re: Testing Chat V: The Final Mysterious Island: Miami Beach

#850 Post by evilsoup »

also Riddick is a pretty good film
if you like the previous films, you'll like this one... but it follows in the steps of the last two films by shifting to another genre. I'm quite looking forward to another entry in the series, if that ever happens.
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